I have never been left or right. Example: the "left" was anti-war and now they are pro-war.
Party? I am with which ever party the blue collar worker is with. Which ever party wants to expand the middle class. At this point that puts me in the Trump camp. Also, you catch the most flak when you're over the target. Do I know what is in his head? No, but there are historical examples of "traitors to their class" or side that have stepped up to the plate and did good, Thomas a Becket / FDR / JFK. Having been in construction and construction management for 50 years, I have learned you have to play the cards you're delt to get the project done. A Trump administration is the best hand I've got at this point.
I think that the terms 'left' and 'right' may be used more here in the UK than in America so I should have taken that into account since most of my readers are American. I grew up in a coal mining community, married a coal miner's daughter and raised a family in a coal mining community. I heard the terms even as a teenager but never fully understood what they meant. The miners' strike of 1984 radicalised me but I didn't understand politics until I started college in 1990 - the I came to understand these terms.
Left and right have lost a lot of meaning in U.S. politics.
Trump is remaking the Republicans into a working class party, where the Democrats are the party of the elites, college educated, and government workers. Kamala is outspending Trump 3:1 due to billionaire support.
The traditional parties, establishment gop and democrats, I regard as the uniparty. And they both hate and despise Trump.
George - I just realised something. Blue collar workers in the UK are working class not middle class: the latter are called 'white collar' workers here. Did someone once say that the Brits and the Yanks are divided by a common language?
Now-a-days a plumber and electrician make more than a desk jocky. Lets change "class" to "income" or "consumption". My father was a machine tool mechanic that ended up late in his career being assigned to Engineering full time to build the automatic riveters that built the bank of tubes for the Multiple Launch Rocket System. He was well paid and had good retirement savings. In construction I split my career between the office and the field. I can do structural analysis. I made more as a superintendent. Companies pay more to git’re done. Maybe skilled craftsmen would have been a better word.
Thanks for that George. The status and incomes of various occupations changes over years. The Clerk, for example, in our history in the UK, used to be considered to be a very prestigious position in the 19th century but in the twentieth it was not valued a great deal - I used to be a clerk of sorts. As a result, Clerk salaries plummeted over the years.
It is 14:30 here in north central Texas. Time to go out on the balcony with a glass of Merlot and watch the traffic. I'm on a country highway. The only thing missing is, I lost my sounding board 22 months ago. " No one appreciates the very special genius of your conversation as the dog does", Christopher Morley.
I do appreciate your site. If you're ever in Texas we'll talk on the balcony....... I have several Argentina high country Malbecs ....we'll check them out
It's nearly 1800 here in Scotland. Hey George, I share your love of dogs but I'm into beers and whiskey nowadays having appreciated a Merlot in the past. We have an English Pointer rescue dog from Turkiye who has issues over his abandonment. But we have compromised over the past five years. We love him to bits. If I am ever in the 'one star state', will certainly check you out and your 'bonnie blue flag'.
I always enjoy RSH's comments, and i partly agree with him about Trump, but his delivery is sometimes a bit direct like my German relatives. I hope he doesn't go in the huff because he always adds a good dimension to the debate and thanks to your blog i have now started reading his. One of your best traits as a blogger which exemplifies your character is to acknowledge when you are incorrect without taking it as a personal affront. My worry about Trump is Israel. His son in law is a big pro Zionist and they set in train the Abraham accords. If Bibi can escalate anymore then i think Trump is his man. Having said that, he isnt the Establishment man and he will no doubt cause trouble for Nato and the war in Ukraine and he might, hopefully, be more pragmatic with Israel as her Greater Israel project flounders but again as i said before, and RSH noted, Adelson gave him a sizeable donation to assist with the Israeli annexation of the West Bank.
The dispute between him and I had nothing to do with judgements on Trump. It is acceptable to say that you disagree with another's point of view but a red line is crossed for me when someone attacks a person rather than their argument. The Ad Hominem fallacy was never allowed in my philosophy groups and this is what I objected to. My examination of Trump comes from journalistic intentions and a journalistic approach. It does not follow that if I find some good things about Trump then I am showing signs of Trump Saviour Syndrome - that was insulting and I will not tolerate personal insults on this platform. I don't think that Richard believes this to be the case - so it is strange that he was so persistent with the claim to the extent that he ended up labeling many people who view the update as Morons. Anyway - on the one hand, I won't bear a grudge but on the other, I don't want anything similar to that from Richard in the future.
You mentioned Jordan Peterson aka now nicknamed Juden Paterstein 'crying' 'jewish' 'israel can do no wrong' professor. He famously started to publicly cry when he received criticism of his unwavering support for israel and zionism. What a sham - he was propably something that was created/used to contain the aggression of the disillusioned young men.
I did look into Jordan Peterson by the way and can't believe the way he is idolised. I do not find him convincing at all. I don't like the idea of 'rules for life' in principle. We share an interest in Nietzsche so I found him interesting at first. I have studied psychology quite a lot both for my Masters Thesis and my PhD and I became suspicious of it over the years - I also became suspicious of psychologists. I wasn't aware of his views on Israel.
Votre "épiphanie" fut le réchauffement climatique, cet outrage à la pensée posée comme vérité indépassable, zone interdite entourée d'un cercle de feu au-delà duquel il est interdit de pénétrer.
Mon épiphanie fut, dans les années 2015, la nécessité (impérieusement démocratique) de faire tomber l'abominable "régime" Assad en Syrie.
Comme vous, j'ai tiré sur un fil. Et, comme vous, toute la pelote m'est tombée sur la tête. Alors une longue série de pensées-zombies ont une à une éclatées devant moi comme les bulles d'un mauvais savon.
Je ne suis pas peu fier, aujourd'hui, d'être un orphelin de la gauche, même s'il faut désormais (se) reconstruire. Et les soirs de grande solitude, je regarde Chomsky défiler tristement en tête du cortège accompagnant le cercueil de la gauche au cimetière. C'est assez revigorant.
Glad to meet a fellow traveler, Mon Ami. With regard to Chomsky, I used to look up to him and even talked to him once when he was giving a talk at Uni. The next in this series is A Liberal Education - which does not, necessarily, help you to think independently.
Chomsky's pro-gulag fury, during the covid dementia, was a real shock to me, even though, by then, I'd already left the shores of the left. I'll read it with interest. Basically, independent thought is a concept that interests me, even if, in practice, we are frankly not helped by our brain, that heavy and very lazy thing. In this respect, the invention of the binary notion of “right” and “left” suits it perfectly.
The article and comments are very illustrative of the various social and psychological factors involved in the process of forming longterm opinions that necessarily colour social and intellectual attitudes in a cultural environment of information overload.
The terms 'left' and 'right' were only ever proximity definitions that have become 'fashionable' commodities, either for self adornment or a derogatory label to 'other' an opponent. A common conversational component of the social process much like 'what football team do you support' before the fight starts.
In as much as it can be understood as a fashion one can assume 'ego' is a significant factor in the maintenance of a fixed longterm attitude in the face of contradictory evidence.
As someone who knows that I am gullible I find it easy to forgive myself for having absorbed an opinion from our information overload environment. The description of your lefty mate's attitude to your attempts to inform him or her of contradictory information was instructive.
Many thanks for that Dude. I'm pleased that you have clearly understood what I'm getting at here. I didn't dwell enough on the derogatory nature of the terms for both 'sides' - so cheers.
You know what I mean Richard - the Deep State is not pulling his strings. I'm not sure why you should stop reading after that. You might have found something really interesting or something that could have given you something better to criticise. Just kidding - hope you are well.
In general, I'm not at all interested in defenses of Trump for any reason. And the "Deep State" includes other interests than the MIC and the intelligence communities, if you are familiar with the origin of the term "Deep State" (look it up).
"Trump Derangement Syndrome" is real, of course, but so is "Trump Savior Syndrome" - and your remark giving that moron any credit for anything at all simply crosses my line at reading any such garbage.
I'm not in a good mood today - like most days - as you might be able to tell.
It should have been obvious to you - if you'd read the whole thing, that I have not got 'Trump Saviour Syndrome' . And yes I will give the man credit where it is due. Why do you hate him so much - just asking. Yes Richard, you sometimes make it obvious that you are not in a good place. But I'm not going to judge you for that. I've looked up the Deep State already btw. Take care.
Where’s the popcorn? Two of my favorite Substack contributors “butting heads” without the conversation turning into a MoA-style ‘barroom brawl’. Recalls that song lyric - “there’s battle lines being drawn, nobody’s right if everybody’s wrong.”. My 2 cents? Black and white versus shades of grey…… whatever floats yer boat. Thanks both of you for caring about our possible futures. ✌️🫶🫠
Trump is a moron. I don't like morons. And I didn't say you had TSS - I said it was real and the opposite is also real. Not that I don't suspect you have the first symptoms of TSS. Giving Trump any credit - in particular the absurd "he's a family man" - who gives a shit? His family sucks, too - is a symptom of TSS.
If you looked up Deep State, you know it was coined in Turkey due to a specific incident. McGovern uses his ridiculously long acronym which I refuse to use but it's a decent recap of what "Deep State" actually means.
And Trump is as subject to that as anyone else, simply because everyone in the Republican Party who has influence over who becomes the candidate is under that control. It's absurd to think otherwise.
What qualifications do you have in psychology that entitles you to identify symptoms in me. You've done this before. Hate Trump as much as you want but don't have a go at me for suggesting that there is some good in the man.
Up until this election they DID have meaning. Me, one of 5. Sat in the Union Hall with my brothers as kids licking envelopes for mailings. In 1980 I was a delegate to the Texas Democrat Party State Convention. In 1982 I ran against Republican Phil Graham when he switched from the Democrat Party to the Republican Party. Directed Energy Beam weapons was a plank in my platform before Reagan announced what they called Star Wars. The special election was in Feburary, Reagan anounced Star Wars in March. I voted for Reagan because I knew about Star Wars. That program, because of its spin-offs, was as JFKish as you could get. But the Demo party rejected it. Another example of why blind party allegiance is worthless (AKA Yellow Dog Democrat).
The biggest issue in the U.S. election is censorship. Trump is the unlikely champion of the blue collar workers. I look at how well his kids are doing vs Joe Biden’s, and it tells you a lot.
I've just seen some figures on funding and Kamala is way ahead in that department. Agree about the children which could say much about Trump's values versus Biden's. When you say censorship is the biggest issue do you mean for voters as a whole or the censorship of Trump as a candidate?
I have never been left or right. Example: the "left" was anti-war and now they are pro-war.
Party? I am with which ever party the blue collar worker is with. Which ever party wants to expand the middle class. At this point that puts me in the Trump camp. Also, you catch the most flak when you're over the target. Do I know what is in his head? No, but there are historical examples of "traitors to their class" or side that have stepped up to the plate and did good, Thomas a Becket / FDR / JFK. Having been in construction and construction management for 50 years, I have learned you have to play the cards you're delt to get the project done. A Trump administration is the best hand I've got at this point.
Trump simply can't be as bad as Kamala and the Democrats.
I think that the terms 'left' and 'right' may be used more here in the UK than in America so I should have taken that into account since most of my readers are American. I grew up in a coal mining community, married a coal miner's daughter and raised a family in a coal mining community. I heard the terms even as a teenager but never fully understood what they meant. The miners' strike of 1984 radicalised me but I didn't understand politics until I started college in 1990 - the I came to understand these terms.
Left and right have lost a lot of meaning in U.S. politics.
Trump is remaking the Republicans into a working class party, where the Democrats are the party of the elites, college educated, and government workers. Kamala is outspending Trump 3:1 due to billionaire support.
The traditional parties, establishment gop and democrats, I regard as the uniparty. And they both hate and despise Trump.
Left and right have lost meaning for me - they no longer make sense and are used in order to divide us.
George - I just realised something. Blue collar workers in the UK are working class not middle class: the latter are called 'white collar' workers here. Did someone once say that the Brits and the Yanks are divided by a common language?
Now-a-days a plumber and electrician make more than a desk jocky. Lets change "class" to "income" or "consumption". My father was a machine tool mechanic that ended up late in his career being assigned to Engineering full time to build the automatic riveters that built the bank of tubes for the Multiple Launch Rocket System. He was well paid and had good retirement savings. In construction I split my career between the office and the field. I can do structural analysis. I made more as a superintendent. Companies pay more to git’re done. Maybe skilled craftsmen would have been a better word.
Thanks for that George. The status and incomes of various occupations changes over years. The Clerk, for example, in our history in the UK, used to be considered to be a very prestigious position in the 19th century but in the twentieth it was not valued a great deal - I used to be a clerk of sorts. As a result, Clerk salaries plummeted over the years.
It is 14:30 here in north central Texas. Time to go out on the balcony with a glass of Merlot and watch the traffic. I'm on a country highway. The only thing missing is, I lost my sounding board 22 months ago. " No one appreciates the very special genius of your conversation as the dog does", Christopher Morley.
I do appreciate your site. If you're ever in Texas we'll talk on the balcony....... I have several Argentina high country Malbecs ....we'll check them out
It's nearly 1800 here in Scotland. Hey George, I share your love of dogs but I'm into beers and whiskey nowadays having appreciated a Merlot in the past. We have an English Pointer rescue dog from Turkiye who has issues over his abandonment. But we have compromised over the past five years. We love him to bits. If I am ever in the 'one star state', will certainly check you out and your 'bonnie blue flag'.
I always enjoy RSH's comments, and i partly agree with him about Trump, but his delivery is sometimes a bit direct like my German relatives. I hope he doesn't go in the huff because he always adds a good dimension to the debate and thanks to your blog i have now started reading his. One of your best traits as a blogger which exemplifies your character is to acknowledge when you are incorrect without taking it as a personal affront. My worry about Trump is Israel. His son in law is a big pro Zionist and they set in train the Abraham accords. If Bibi can escalate anymore then i think Trump is his man. Having said that, he isnt the Establishment man and he will no doubt cause trouble for Nato and the war in Ukraine and he might, hopefully, be more pragmatic with Israel as her Greater Israel project flounders but again as i said before, and RSH noted, Adelson gave him a sizeable donation to assist with the Israeli annexation of the West Bank.
The dispute between him and I had nothing to do with judgements on Trump. It is acceptable to say that you disagree with another's point of view but a red line is crossed for me when someone attacks a person rather than their argument. The Ad Hominem fallacy was never allowed in my philosophy groups and this is what I objected to. My examination of Trump comes from journalistic intentions and a journalistic approach. It does not follow that if I find some good things about Trump then I am showing signs of Trump Saviour Syndrome - that was insulting and I will not tolerate personal insults on this platform. I don't think that Richard believes this to be the case - so it is strange that he was so persistent with the claim to the extent that he ended up labeling many people who view the update as Morons. Anyway - on the one hand, I won't bear a grudge but on the other, I don't want anything similar to that from Richard in the future.
You mentioned Jordan Peterson aka now nicknamed Juden Paterstein 'crying' 'jewish' 'israel can do no wrong' professor. He famously started to publicly cry when he received criticism of his unwavering support for israel and zionism. What a sham - he was propably something that was created/used to contain the aggression of the disillusioned young men.
I did look into Jordan Peterson by the way and can't believe the way he is idolised. I do not find him convincing at all. I don't like the idea of 'rules for life' in principle. We share an interest in Nietzsche so I found him interesting at first. I have studied psychology quite a lot both for my Masters Thesis and my PhD and I became suspicious of it over the years - I also became suspicious of psychologists. I wasn't aware of his views on Israel.
Bravo cher Monsieur, excellent papier
Votre "épiphanie" fut le réchauffement climatique, cet outrage à la pensée posée comme vérité indépassable, zone interdite entourée d'un cercle de feu au-delà duquel il est interdit de pénétrer.
Mon épiphanie fut, dans les années 2015, la nécessité (impérieusement démocratique) de faire tomber l'abominable "régime" Assad en Syrie.
Comme vous, j'ai tiré sur un fil. Et, comme vous, toute la pelote m'est tombée sur la tête. Alors une longue série de pensées-zombies ont une à une éclatées devant moi comme les bulles d'un mauvais savon.
Je ne suis pas peu fier, aujourd'hui, d'être un orphelin de la gauche, même s'il faut désormais (se) reconstruire. Et les soirs de grande solitude, je regarde Chomsky défiler tristement en tête du cortège accompagnant le cercueil de la gauche au cimetière. C'est assez revigorant.
Glad to meet a fellow traveler, Mon Ami. With regard to Chomsky, I used to look up to him and even talked to him once when he was giving a talk at Uni. The next in this series is A Liberal Education - which does not, necessarily, help you to think independently.
Chomsky's pro-gulag fury, during the covid dementia, was a real shock to me, even though, by then, I'd already left the shores of the left. I'll read it with interest. Basically, independent thought is a concept that interests me, even if, in practice, we are frankly not helped by our brain, that heavy and very lazy thing. In this respect, the invention of the binary notion of “right” and “left” suits it perfectly.
Excellent.
The article and comments are very illustrative of the various social and psychological factors involved in the process of forming longterm opinions that necessarily colour social and intellectual attitudes in a cultural environment of information overload.
The terms 'left' and 'right' were only ever proximity definitions that have become 'fashionable' commodities, either for self adornment or a derogatory label to 'other' an opponent. A common conversational component of the social process much like 'what football team do you support' before the fight starts.
In as much as it can be understood as a fashion one can assume 'ego' is a significant factor in the maintenance of a fixed longterm attitude in the face of contradictory evidence.
As someone who knows that I am gullible I find it easy to forgive myself for having absorbed an opinion from our information overload environment. The description of your lefty mate's attitude to your attempts to inform him or her of contradictory information was instructive.
PS loved the final X post ;o)
Many thanks for that Dude. I'm pleased that you have clearly understood what I'm getting at here. I didn't dwell enough on the derogatory nature of the terms for both 'sides' - so cheers.
"no one is pulling his strings "
i stopped reading after that. What part of $100 million given to him by Adelson's wife did you miss?
You know what I mean Richard - the Deep State is not pulling his strings. I'm not sure why you should stop reading after that. You might have found something really interesting or something that could have given you something better to criticise. Just kidding - hope you are well.
In general, I'm not at all interested in defenses of Trump for any reason. And the "Deep State" includes other interests than the MIC and the intelligence communities, if you are familiar with the origin of the term "Deep State" (look it up).
"Trump Derangement Syndrome" is real, of course, but so is "Trump Savior Syndrome" - and your remark giving that moron any credit for anything at all simply crosses my line at reading any such garbage.
I'm not in a good mood today - like most days - as you might be able to tell.
It should have been obvious to you - if you'd read the whole thing, that I have not got 'Trump Saviour Syndrome' . And yes I will give the man credit where it is due. Why do you hate him so much - just asking. Yes Richard, you sometimes make it obvious that you are not in a good place. But I'm not going to judge you for that. I've looked up the Deep State already btw. Take care.
Where’s the popcorn? Two of my favorite Substack contributors “butting heads” without the conversation turning into a MoA-style ‘barroom brawl’. Recalls that song lyric - “there’s battle lines being drawn, nobody’s right if everybody’s wrong.”. My 2 cents? Black and white versus shades of grey…… whatever floats yer boat. Thanks both of you for caring about our possible futures. ✌️🫶🫠
Trump is a moron. I don't like morons. And I didn't say you had TSS - I said it was real and the opposite is also real. Not that I don't suspect you have the first symptoms of TSS. Giving Trump any credit - in particular the absurd "he's a family man" - who gives a shit? His family sucks, too - is a symptom of TSS.
If you looked up Deep State, you know it was coined in Turkey due to a specific incident. McGovern uses his ridiculously long acronym which I refuse to use but it's a decent recap of what "Deep State" actually means.
And Trump is as subject to that as anyone else, simply because everyone in the Republican Party who has influence over who becomes the candidate is under that control. It's absurd to think otherwise.
What qualifications do you have in psychology that entitles you to identify symptoms in me. You've done this before. Hate Trump as much as you want but don't have a go at me for suggesting that there is some good in the man.
Suggesting there is some good in Trump is all the symptom I need. No degree needed.
Up until this election they DID have meaning. Me, one of 5. Sat in the Union Hall with my brothers as kids licking envelopes for mailings. In 1980 I was a delegate to the Texas Democrat Party State Convention. In 1982 I ran against Republican Phil Graham when he switched from the Democrat Party to the Republican Party. Directed Energy Beam weapons was a plank in my platform before Reagan announced what they called Star Wars. The special election was in Feburary, Reagan anounced Star Wars in March. I voted for Reagan because I knew about Star Wars. That program, because of its spin-offs, was as JFKish as you could get. But the Demo party rejected it. Another example of why blind party allegiance is worthless (AKA Yellow Dog Democrat).
You are raking up some memories for me now - Star Wars! And a huge movie franchise emerged form that.
The biggest issue in the U.S. election is censorship. Trump is the unlikely champion of the blue collar workers. I look at how well his kids are doing vs Joe Biden’s, and it tells you a lot.
I've just seen some figures on funding and Kamala is way ahead in that department. Agree about the children which could say much about Trump's values versus Biden's. When you say censorship is the biggest issue do you mean for voters as a whole or the censorship of Trump as a candidate?
It’s for me individually in the censorship issue. For most people my guess is the economy is the top issue, followed by the woke culture issues.
I was shocked when Trump after Jan 6 was censored / deplatformed by all the Internet giants, Facebook, Twitter, and Google. And even Shopify.
And the Twitter Files by Matt Taibbi was eye opening on the involvement of the us government in censorship.
I understand.
I just saw this on X - https://x.com/i/status/1850483719406023016. It sums up the irrational Trump hatred out there.